|
|
Post by Xamnam on Aug 22, 2018 11:25:26 GMT -6
since the question is "can you.." the answer is yes. Whether it's useful or ethical to do so is more complicated. This is the equivalent to the teacher responding, "Yes you can go to the bathroom, do you mean 'May I go to the bathroom"? We're just honoring the late: Symb. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 11:29:25 GMT -6
And I do think it's impossible to separate Woody Allen from the movie's he has directed because he is such an outsized figure/influence. It has nothing to do with losing yourself in the story. That's just being willfully ignorant. Thanks for informing me of my actual ability to consume media the way I believe I do and judging me accordingly. Do you happen to be a white man, by chance? I am! Whatever helps you rewatch Midnight in Paris, bud. |
|
|
|
Post by ultravisitor on Aug 22, 2018 11:30:11 GMT -6
White.
Right.
Wow. It even rhymes.
|
|
|
|
Post by goodson on Aug 22, 2018 11:31:14 GMT -6
separating art from the artist would be a great crtical theory in a vaccuum, but we live in a world where imbalances exasperated by fame, power, and influence are used by awful men constantly, and engaging with these pieces that you have designated as simple "consumption" literally gives them money (even if you don't spend money you are still contributing to their fame and influence which can then be utilized by them) by excusing awful behavior commited by men for the sake of quality art, we directly perpetuate a culture that rewards this behavior as well as makes it more difficult for their victims Pretty sure that everyone's faves are problematic to someone for some reason. Let's all just stop consuming art altogether. Amy Schumer? RACIST BITCH Polanski and Allen and Sexton? SEXUAL ABUSERS Dahl? ANTISEMITE This list could get very long. a very long list of almost exclusively men 👀💅 i don't know why instead of simply choosing to be more conscious about what you consume you have slided all the way over to "no art allowed" |
|
|
|
Post by ultravisitor on Aug 22, 2018 11:32:00 GMT -6
The slope is slippery.
Who decides and makes the rules?
Will it be the white people?
Am I the lone brown/yellow person in this thread? Because I've already been told to sit down. By a white person.
|
|
|
|
Post by alady on Aug 22, 2018 11:41:30 GMT -6
While totally acknowledging that Amy Schumer is terrible (and I won't derail this thread any further) I don't see how you can read these statements and find her at fault in this particular encounter
guy pushes you on the bed
His fingers poked inside me like they had lost their keys in there.
pushing aggressively into my thigh
tried to mash at this point his third ball into my vagina.
I felt faceless, and nameless.
I was just a warm body
I want to scream for myself, "Get out of here, Amy."
I escaped
|
|
|
|
Post by neader on Aug 22, 2018 11:46:07 GMT -6
You're right, I apologize for bringing that up.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 11:46:51 GMT -6
The slope is slippery. Who decides and makes the rules? Will it be the white people? Am I the lone brown/yellow person in this thread? Because I've already been told to sit down. By a white person. So are you actually accusing me of being racist because I offered an opinion that was contradictory of yours? Interesting way to shut down a conversation. I'm legit sorry for any terrible shit you've experienced at the hands of awful white people, but our exchange is on a music message board and was about, of all people, Woody Allen. Come the fuck on. |
|
|
|
Post by alady on Aug 22, 2018 11:49:58 GMT -6
I mean she is problematic for lots of reasons, but I don't see it here.
Do we seem to pardon white men more easily than men of color? The list above was all white ppl....
|
|
|
|
Post by Xamnam on Aug 22, 2018 11:50:49 GMT -6
Do we seem to pardon white men more easily than men of color? The list above was all white ppl.... ∞% |
|
|
|
Post by Xamnam on Aug 22, 2018 11:51:47 GMT -6
Not to mention, the barriers to having a career successful enough to cause a debate of worth of art vs. character of person, etc., etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by alady on Aug 22, 2018 11:51:54 GMT -6
I suppose that was a bit rhetorical lol white men win everything
|
|
|
|
Post by ultravisitor on Aug 22, 2018 11:55:52 GMT -6
The slope is slippery. Who decides and makes the rules? Will it be the white people? Am I the lone brown/yellow person in this thread? Because I've already been told to sit down. By a white person. So are you formally accusing me of being racist because I offered an opinion that was contradictory of yours? Interesting way to shut down a conversation. I'm legit sorry for any terrible shit you've experienced at the hands of awful white people, but our exchange is on a music message board and was about, of all people, Woody Allen. Come the fuck on. No. I'm not doing that. I don't think you're racist. But you totally invalidated my own experience in this thread. Everyone can see that. Maybe think about why that was so easy for you to do. |
|
|
|
Post by teekoh on Aug 22, 2018 11:57:01 GMT -6
I don’t know what it is verbatim, but Chris Rock had a bit about the margin of error for people of color. Essentially that any mistakes are career-ending, and that was only for public reception of their art, not any issues in their personal lives.
|
|
|
|
Post by goodson on Aug 22, 2018 11:58:04 GMT -6
I don’t know what it is verbatim, but Chris Rock had a bit about the margin of error for people of color. Essentially that any mistakes are career-ending, and that was only for public reception of their art, not any issues in their personal lives. nate parker basically does not have a career at this point but we continue to let woody allen and roman polanski make films |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 12:02:51 GMT -6
So are you formally accusing me of being racist because I offered an opinion that was contradictory of yours? Interesting way to shut down a conversation. I'm legit sorry for any terrible shit you've experienced at the hands of awful white people, but our exchange is on a music message board and was about, of all people, Woody Allen. Come the fuck on. No. I'm not doing that. I don't think you're racist. But you totally invalidated my own experience in this thread. Everyone can see that. Maybe think about why that was so easy for you to do. I think of you as a floating Jim James head and that's about it. My conversation with you was offering my opinion to a fellow boarder - it was my opinion and I'm not trying to force you to do anything, just offering my perspective. That's what everyone has been doing in this thread. Maybe I could have approached it more delicately, but Woody Allen is just about the most egregious example and your example of Midnight in Paris was weird. |
|
|
|
Post by nanatod on Aug 22, 2018 12:08:09 GMT -6
I still enjoy listening to puff the magic dragon, even though back in the day peter yarrow was convicted of hooking up w/ a way underage girl, who is now 62 yrs old.
|
|
|
|
Post by ultravisitor on Aug 22, 2018 12:11:39 GMT -6
I don't think you were trying to force me into anything.
I just thought you were an asshole for being flippant towards me. And your continuing to point out that Woody Allen is an "egregious example" still seems to prioritize your own experience over others.
Whatever.
|
|
|
|
Post by ten15 on Aug 22, 2018 12:12:04 GMT -6
I mean she is problematic for lots of reasons, but I don't see it here. Do we seem to pardon white men more easily than men of color? The list above was all white ppl.... idk - I feel like there are a lot of people (men?) of color in the music industry that have some terrible attitudes and have done awful things that still have/had a career. See R. Kelly, Migos, Chris Brown, Brockhampton. |
|
|
|
Post by alady on Aug 22, 2018 12:13:13 GMT -6
I still enjoy listening to puff the magic dragon, even though back in the day peter yarrow was convicted of hooking up w/ a way underage girl, who is now 62 yrs old. I think this is the final word on the topic, let's clock this thread |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 12:14:16 GMT -6
I don't think you were trying to force me into anything. I just thought you were an asshole for being flippant towards me. And your continuing to point out that Woody Allen is an "egregious example" still seems to prioritize your own experience over others. Whatever. I'm prioritizing the experience of the women he abused. |
|
|
|
Post by ultravisitor on Aug 22, 2018 12:15:56 GMT -6
I don't think you were trying to force me into anything. I just thought you were an asshole for being flippant towards me. And your continuing to point out that Woody Allen is an "egregious example" still seems to prioritize your own experience over others. Whatever. I'm prioritizing the experience of the women he abused. Still sounds like "my way is the right way". |
|
|
|
Post by neader on Aug 22, 2018 12:18:04 GMT -6
I mean she is problematic for lots of reasons, but I don't see it here. Do we seem to pardon white men more easily than men of color? The list above was all white ppl.... idk - I feel like there are a lot of people (men?) of color in the music industry that have some terrible attitudes and have done awful things that still have/had a career. See R. Kelly, Migos, Chris Brown, Brockhampton. They kicked out the member who had a history of abusing women, am I missing something? |
|
|
|
Post by ten15 on Aug 22, 2018 12:21:45 GMT -6
idk - I feel like there are a lot of people (men?) of color in the music industry that have some terrible attitudes and have done awful things that still have/had a career. See R. Kelly, Migos, Chris Brown, Brockhampton. They kicked out the member who had a history of abusing women, am I missing something? Ok. I guess I don't keep up on my Brockhampton news. Where can I sign up for the newsletter?  |
|
|
|
Post by thebosma on Aug 22, 2018 12:22:39 GMT -6
They kicked out the member who had a history of abusing women, am I missing something? Ok. I guess I don't keep up on my Brockhampton news. Where can I sign up for the newsletter? I'll get you in on the text chain |
|
|
|
Post by neader on Aug 22, 2018 12:23:10 GMT -6
They kicked out the member who had a history of abusing women, am I missing something? Ok. I guess I don't keep up on my Brockhampton news. Where can I sign up for the newsletter? |
|
|
|
Post by teekoh on Aug 22, 2018 12:23:46 GMT -6
Pretty cool that nana keeps tabs on those affected by the indiscretions of the cast of Puff the Magic Dragon.
|
|
|
|
Post by neader on Aug 22, 2018 12:25:03 GMT -6
Speaking of dragon associations being assholes
|
|
|
|
Post by nanatod on Aug 22, 2018 12:35:45 GMT -6
I just knew it as a song by PP&M; didn't realize they made a TV show out of it. |
|
|
|
Post by dij22 on Aug 22, 2018 13:01:33 GMT -6
As Neader and Wretched mentioned, I think it's imperative to separate the artist from the art precisely because we are so willing to do mental gymnastics to excuse problematic/awful behavior from artists we like.
Millions of people literally blamed a victim of horrific abuse because they liked Chris Brown. Millions of people blame victims of horrific abuse because they still like R. Kelly.
|
|
